Glossary entry

English term or phrase:

ملک یا ملکٔ

Urdu translation:

ملک

    The asker opted for community grading. The question was closed on 2010-11-18 16:54:10 based on peer agreement (or, if there were too few peer comments, asker preference.)
Nov 14, 2010 18:50
13 yrs ago
English term

ملک یا ملکٔ

English to Urdu Other General / Conversation / Greetings / Letters
Some times people Put a 'hamza' ٔ on ک. Is it permissble?
Proposed translations (Urdu)
4 +6 ملک
5 +1 ملک

Discussion

Qudsia Lone Nov 15, 2010:
Symbol on ک I just looked below, Quamrul Islam sahib has given a link to a document on Arabic script. I didn't get a chance to browse the full document but page 5 shows the different form of the Arabic ک. This is the link he gave:
http://omega.enstb.org/yannis/pdf/arabic-simpli98.pdf

According to above, the symbol is not a humza, it's an orthographic sign. (I still prefer 'squiggle'). So, I'd say if a person uses an Urdu font that does not automatically give the squiggle like Ramesh Bhatt sahib's font does, and one adds a humza manually to get a similar look, that would be incorrect because that sign is not suppose to be a humza.
Qudsia Lone Nov 15, 2010:
Nafees Nastaleeq I also have Nafees Nastaleeq but I don't get that squiggle on ک. I used to have UNINASTALEEQ and that didn't show the squiggle on ک. None of my Urdu fonts do. (I think we should probably not call it a 'humza' as in Arabic too, the squiggle sign is not there to add any 'humza' sound to ک, it's just a symbol that comes along with the letter ک, when it occurs in its full form and looks a lot like humza). But I've never seen it in printed Urdu text; always in Arabic text.
Ramesh Bhatt Nov 15, 2010:
It is not the Hamza It is just the Font style, in my view. Nafees Nastaleeq Font shows it when you type ک but it disappears soon after you type another letter joining ک. Other fonts have no such problem. And is there any Urdu word that can have ک with the Hamza sound in the end. I am not aware about that.

Proposed translations

+6
1 hr
Selected

ملک

To my knowledge, in Urdu, ک is written without the *humza/squiggly sign.

In Arabic, in Holy Quran when ک is written in full, whether in Indo-Pak script or Uthmani script, it has the squiggly sign on it. (This sign is not written when ک is followed by a joining letter, as in the second ک in the same phrase below.)

ذٰلِكَ الْڪِتٰبُ لَا رَيْبَ

To check the usage in today's Arabic, I put two simple Arabic words ذالک and تلک in a search engine and most entries showed the ک with the squiggly sign, but there was one entry I saw that didn't have it.

So, I think if someone is writing Urdu with the squiggle on ک, they're using their Arabic keyboard or are using Arabic script on purpose. I think if one has a choice, one shouldn't use the squiggle. If someone else is using it, I'll give them the benefit of the doubt that they know what letter it is, they're just being unnecessarily (if not inappropriately) stylish with it.

Perhaps there is some old Urdu script that does use the squiggle on the ک, I don't remember seeing one though.

*P.S. I'm not sure if that symbol on ک can be called a 'humza' as it looks different then a regular humza...a "squiggle" perhaps? If the symbol is indeed a different sign then 'humza' and people are adding a 'humza' on their ک, then that could be considered wrong.



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Note added at 1 hr (2010-11-14 20:46:09 GMT)
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Correction: In second last line, please read the first "then" as "than"...so it would read:
"If the symbol is indeed a different sign than 'humza' and ...."
Peer comment(s):

agree Irshad Muhammad : Excellent! Best research and explanation.
6 hrs
agree Quamrul Islam : The orthographic sign over Kaf is not a 'hamza': http://omega.enstb.org/yannis/pdf/arabic-simpli98.pdf
7 hrs
agree abufaraz
13 hrs
agree Haris Ali Dogar
14 hrs
agree Shahab Arif
14 hrs
agree Kausar Saiyed (X) : Yes, that is just another way of writing 'Kaaf'. I have an old version of 'Deevaan-e-Meer' it has that kind of kaaf written.
1 day 22 hrs
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Honestly, I was quite satisfied and happy with the answer that I got from Mr. Sajjad Nadeem. But later when I got the answer from Ms. Lone, I thought it to be comprehensive and complete. I thank all the participants especially Ms. Lone and Mr. Nadeem "
+1
7 mins

ملک

میرے خیال میں یہ انداز کتابت کا اختلاف ہے۔ اس کے لفظ کے معنی میں کوئی تبدیلی واقع نہیں ہوتی مگر ء والا ک استعمال کرنا عام روزمرہ کے معمول کی کتابت میں استعمال نہیں ہوتا۔ اب اس کے بنیادی اسلوب سے تو میں واقف نہیں ہوں مگر اس کی اجازت کسی حد تک دی جا سکتی ہے اگر ساری کی ساری تحریر اسی انداز میں ہو۔ بہرحال عام کتابت میں اس کا استعمال میرے مطابق موزوں نہیں ہے۔
Peer comment(s):

agree aneelazia
3 days 5 hrs
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