Glossary entry

Italian term or phrase:

cattivo latino

English translation:

corrupted/bad Latin

Added to glossary by Alessandra Renna
Aug 24, 2008 21:24
15 yrs ago
Italian term

cattivo latino

Italian to English Other General / Conversation / Greetings / Letters
what is generally meant by this, please? In my text (no esp. good examples) it could mean deceitful words
Change log

Aug 25, 2008 13:22: Alessandra Renna changed "Edited KOG entry" from "<a href="/profile/100794">Rachel Fell's</a> old entry - "cattivo latino"" to ""corrupted/bad Latin""

Discussion

Rachel Fell (asker) Aug 24, 2008:
example e.g. voce/diffusione dell’insincerità, della menzogna,
del cattivo latino!
Monia Di Martino Aug 24, 2008:
Maybe if you show the entire sentence, we can understand what your doubts refer to.

Proposed translations

9 hrs
Selected

corrupted latin

a master of "cattivo latino" was Vitruvius.
"Nella storia della prosa d'arte nell'antichit� tracciata da Eduard Norden alla fine del XIX secolo ben poco spazio � riservato a Vitruvio e al suo difficile, stilisticamente poco elegante trattato sull'architettura: poche righe, meno di una pagina, bastano per liquidare una prosa che, pur contenendo alcuni elementi di latino volgare degni d'interesse, risulterebbe per lo pi� pretenziosa e stucchevole, oltre che poco originale, data la forte, spesso pedissequa dipendenza di Vitruvio dalle sue fonti. Le parole di Norden sono significativamente rivelatrici di quel vero e proprio pregiudizio, riguardante l'opera vitruviana in tutti i suoi aspetti, che ha dominato a lungo fra i filologi classici e che era in gran parte determinato da un vero e proprio mito, quello del cattivo latino di Vitruvio: di questo "gergo tecnico", come si legge in uno studio del 1911 sul latino postdassico, "che � stato considerato un esempio di latino volgare, ma che non � n� classico n� volgare: � semplicemente cattivo"
http://www.liberonweb.com/asp/libro.asp?ISBN=8806122398

However, Alberti, a master of Latin prose, noted that Vitruvius' "very text is evidence that he wrote neither Latin or Greek, so that as far as we are concerned, he might just as well not have written at all, rather than write something that we cannot understand."
http://www.kirjasto.sci.fi/vitruv.htm

"voce/diffusione dell’insincerità, della menzogna, del cattivo latino!". This sentence reminds me of a sort of false friends. A language which has lost its pureness and consequently its very meaning. A sort of bastard, spurious language corrupted by non-classical or barbarous style
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Thank you - I used this, as it seemed to suit my text/film best, but other answers were also good"
+6
17 mins

bad Latin

I'd say it simply means "incorrect Latin", but it's hard to say without any context.
Peer comment(s):

agree Monia Di Martino
9 mins
agree Science451
37 mins
agree Dana Rinaldi
10 hrs
agree Pompeo Lattanzi : It simply means "bad (=incorrect) language", just as Mirella says.
11 hrs
agree Mary Carroll Richer LaFlèche
12 hrs
agree Sarah Jane Webb
13 hrs
Something went wrong...
7 mins

Vulgar Latin

Not as pejorative as it sounds -- just the speech of ordinary Latin-speakers as opposed to highly educated ones.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 37 mins (2008-08-24 22:02:39 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Could it simply mean "bad language", in the sense that we would say "pardon my French" in English?
Note from asker:
Thanks Kari - that's what I was thinking but had found different terms for vulgar Latin and this seems to be meant in a pejorative way in my text, whereas v. Latin isn't meant like that
Something went wrong...
+1
1 hr

improper latin

and many of the synonym of 'improper' can also be used...

and no, I knew but I checked it, it is never used to mean 'saying lies'
I always heard it used to mean a latin grammatically incorrect

instead

http://www.google.it/search?num=30&hl=it&safe=off&q="imprope...
Peer comment(s):

agree Mary Carroll Richer LaFlèche
11 hrs
grazie molte! :))
Something went wrong...
2 hrs

Dog Latin

I believe this is the analogous English expression.
Note from asker:
Thanks DF - also seems fine, though didn't fit my text
Something went wrong...
16 hrs

(my) scarce knowledge/expertise/capacity

Il Latino come tale non c'entra direttamente con questa espressione idiomatica e metaforica dell'italiano.
Si intende "una conoscenza approssimativa di una materia" e, in senso traslato, "con scarsa cognizione di causa" o "essendo poco preparato".
Mancando il contesto, applico la traduzione NON letteralmente.
Si trova esempio di tale uso anche in francese, come cita il Merriam Webster (vide infra).

Al massimo è ipotizzabile un significato come spiega De Mauro (vedi sotto), riguardante (e mi pare che la citazione di Dante sia chiarissima) la proprietà di esprimersi, intendendosi per "latino" quella lingua "alta, colta, che presuppone preparazione e NON approssimazione", ma non necessariamente "il" latino (latina lingua).
Valete!

Dal Merriam Webster:
Main Entry: au bout de son la·tin
Pronunciation: \ō-büd-sōⁿ-lä-taⁿ, -bü-də-\
Function: foreign term
Etymology: French
: at the end of one's Latin : at the end of one's mental resources

Da DE Mauro:
6 s.m. OB LE modo di esprimersi, discorso: per chiare parole e con preciso | latin rispuose (Dante)
Something went wrong...
Term search
  • All of ProZ.com
  • Term search
  • Jobs
  • Forums
  • Multiple search