| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18] > | Moving on from freelance translation, starting a new career Thread poster: James Greenfield
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Christopher Schröder wrote: OK, you've been screaming "fire, fire" for 15 years but you're not being negative?! 
"At" 15 years (that's one point in time), not "for" 15 years.
I also said "My experience was not bad for 18 years in a row."
I can't relate to all your negative views
Is this forum only for views that relate to your experience?
Proz is a big city. Imagine if I write "Stop complaining, I can't relate to your experiences" on a banner and start driving all over South Chicago...
Everyone's experience is different. My translation environment is totally different than yours, and there are plenty of people afraid to write in the fora, assuming someone might mock them. Did you forget the title of this thread, which is not rosy at all?
Just don't read what I write - problem solved.
| | | | | Zhan Zhuang (Standing Zen) to counter spinal injuries/high BP, etc. | Feb 20 |
This simple exercise has worked wonders to my stamina and energy levels.
| | | | Lieven Malaise
Belgium
Local time: 14:38
Member (2020)
French to Dutch
+ ...
Lefteris Kritikakis wrote:
Is this forum only for views that relate to your experience?
Of course not, but I'm not the one pretending to know all about this industry and generalizing until he drops dead.
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Denis Danchenko wrote: This simple exercise has worked wonders to my stamina and energy levels.
You should talk with Christopher, his injury is more serious than mine.
(I'm in the US, if I get a stroke I'll run for Senate).
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Baran Keki 
Türkiye
Local time: 15:38
Member
English to Turkish
Lefteris Kritikakis wrote:
his injury is more serious than mine.
Who'd have thought freelance translation was a 'back-breaking labour'?
| | | | P.L.F. Persio
Netherlands
Local time: 14:38
Member (2010)
English to Italian
+ ...
| | Just saw this on Facebook | Feb 20 |
Tom in London wrote:
Money isn't everything.
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Baran Keki wrote:Who'd have thought freelance translation was a 'back-breaking labour'?
Spinal injuries are the worst thing.
On the other statement "life is what you make it" - I would paraphrase an old statement of a cardinal, by saying "show me the most admired master of life, and I'll find you 20 instances in which he was a total idiot".
Even more wise is the referred Zen Master from the movie "Charlie Wilson's War" at (0:50): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2cjVhUrmII
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Certainly a few people with some spare time today. You bunch of part-timers
Carlos A R de Souza wrote:
But the point is, if everyone says their life is peachy when it isn't....
Well, it's always worth bearing in mind, I think, that what people say is happening, and what actually is happening, might not be the same thing. Moreover, some people treat online environments as if they are there to host their showreel. Edited highlights.
The unfortunate corollary is that anyone who is honest about sub-optimum circumstances runs the risk of being made to feel inadequate. Anyone seen the OP lately? Is it surprising when the tone of some responses to posts in that vein is essentially either "you must be doing it wrong" or "it's not affecting me so it isn't happening"?
| | | | Dan Lucas
United Kingdom
Local time: 13:38
Member (2014)
Japanese to English
Charlie Bavington wrote:
Is it surprising when the tone of some responses to posts in that vein is essentially either "you must be doing it wrong" or "it's not affecting me so it isn't happening"?
The people who are doing badly are as guilty of brute-force extrapolation from individual circumstances to derive a general principle as the people who claim to be doing okay.
"I'm doing badly, therefore the industry is going to hell in a hand basket" is no more insightful than "I'm doing okay, therefore the industry is fine."
There is no one market. We all know this.
I think most of the people who claim to be doing okay are pretty accepting of the fact that individual experience varies, and keenly aware of the fragility of whatever success they have achieved, as evidenced by the recent comments on health.
It should be possible to empathise with the OP's plight (as many of us did) without accepting the argument that his fate is inevitable for the rest of us.
Dan
| | | | | With all due respect... | Feb 20 |
Dan Lucas wrote: Christopher Schröder wrote:
Nobody’s saying it’s easy being self-employed…🙈 Being successful in a particular career doesn't mean that you have had an easy ride; quite the contrary in most cases. I think this is something that Carlos and people like him fail to understand. Nobody here is saying that their life is a bed of roses (are they?).
With all due respect, Dan, I'm aware a career isn't easy. My own experience spans 11 years in this field, during which I've managed satisfactorily. However, my purpose here is not to boast about myself.
Rather, my focus is on the collective bargaining power of translators.
The crux of the matter in our discussions isn't the 10% of the translators are super rich and can afford a house in Malibu; instead, it is about addressing the struggles faced by the remaining 90% who find it difficult to sustain themselves solely through translation work, often needing to supplement their income elsewhere.
And it's not their fault.
The internet commoditizes many markets, and it has been widely discussed in this forum how translators have been suffering because of this trend ever since the 2000s. Even if a senior translator is successful in not having their rates cut, it's an ordeal to raise them.
This is why I'll step in for Lefteris. He was not showing negativity, but was merely stating that it is very important that we translators rush to extinguish the bad rates that burn down the monthly incomes of most translators in the form of stagnant rates.
When we recognize the reality that many translators in this forum are struggling to increase their rates, and yet a noticeable portion of members respond with remarks like, "I've been making plenty of money; those who haven't only have themselves to blame," consider the broader impact on our community. Such attitude can demoralize our colleagues who are dealing with similar challenges, ultimately harming all translators. This mindset hinders our ability to unite and advocate for better conditions, leading clients to believe there's little reason to offer higher rates.
This is why it's so crucial that our discussions focus less on individual achievements and more on our collective circumstances. We can only enhance our negotiating power as a group by staying together.
[Edited at 2024-02-20 22:07 GMT]
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Carlos A R de Souza wrote:
We can only enhance our negotiating power as a group by staying together.
The problem is, unlike a set of employees under one employer, we're not all in the same boat. Although Dan seems above to be arguing against a point I wasn't really making I can only agree with him that there isn't one market. So, for example, I don't even read what LK posts any more because his world bears zero relation to mine, and life is too short .
There was a feeble attempt to half-arsedly unionize years ago (No Peanuts, I remember blogging about it). It came to nothing. I seem to recall the organiser fell from grace after some drama or other.
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| Translating is not a career | Feb 21 |
Carlos A R de Souza wrote: I'm aware a career isn't easy.
In a career you have promotions, benefits, building a resume, and the possibility to even become a Partner. An actual career implies progressing through different roles.
"Contract-based work" (hand-to-mouth gig) such as translating, is not a career.
It's not a business either. You don't own a business (which you can sell in the future).
It's not employment either (no benefits, no legal protection).
My youngest daughter, still a student, teaches Spanish on the side $65/hr for extra cash. During COVID she was making $3K per month. She knows that's not a career. Same for private math teachers between actual careers. Same for most YouTubers who make about 2-3K/month (they know it's not a career, just a lucky gig).
Self-isolation of translators (no reality checks), make them construct strange realities about their roles and how little control they actually have.
[Edited at 2024-02-21 04:50 GMT]
| | | | | Sorry - could not resist flooding the feed... | Feb 21 |
Lefteris Kritikakis wrote:
Self-isolation of translators (no reality checks), make them construct strange realities about their roles and how little control they actually have.
...with the passage from the postface to 'Translation as a Profession' by Daniel Gouadec, 2007:
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Who cares about getting translations done anyway? And about having a choice of languages into the bargain? Except, maybe, a handful of originals who haven’t surrendered to either SMOG (Standard MOdern Globlish) or IBM
(International Business Mandarin), and insist on speaking the ancient dialects (sorry, languages!).
Just like that funny-looking, funny-sounding professor the other day on the WVU (World Virtual University) channel, talking about the translation of some antiquity: novels? poems? lieds? Ah! lieder? Yes, lieder. Or maybe not.
Well, anyway, something from ages ago. Centuries Before Gates.
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| | | | Lieven Malaise
Belgium
Local time: 14:38
Member (2020)
French to Dutch
+ ...
Lefteris Kritikakis wrote:
In a career you have promotions, benefits, building a resume, and the possibility to even become a Partner. An actual career implies progressing through different roles.
"Contract-based work" (hand-to-mouth gig) such as translating, is not a career.
It's not a business either. You don't own a business (which you can sell in the future).
It's not employment either (no benefits, no legal protection).
This is all semantics. A career can be what you describe, but it's basically nothing more than the path someone follows in a certain industry during his working life, be it with or without promotions or a "business he can sell" (another example of semantics, by the way, because every freelance translator is of course a micro-business, whatever you may think about that).
Once again you are creating drama ("freelance translators are poor s***ers!") where there shouldn't be created any. Moreover, if I would have the views you have, my God, I would have left this industry years and years ago, instead of behaving like a sitting duck that's apparently being shot at from every possible direction.
[Bijgewerkt op 2024-02-21 08:35 GMT]
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